Dear Denise (Rin),

My name is Mike and I teach at Hunan University of Humanities, Science & Technology (HUHST). I know little about the school you mentioned save that several of our students made complaints last semester about proselytizing (I actually had to look the word up for spelling). The school is just down the street from us and made a pitch on campus for students to sign up for tutoring classes. Many checked them out during an Open House invitation, and a few attended several sessions. They told me that it was soon thereafter that they were being questioned about their beliefs. "Why don't you believe in God," one was asked, and so on. I know nothing more than this; I haven't seen their signs around campus since.

I will say, however, that a few of us American teachers have noticed how unfriendly the teachers are when we meet them on the streets, this is a rather small "city" afterall. We have unfortunately had no contact otherwise, and that's a shame. Why shouldn't we? So many of our students are preparing for a slew of exams; it boggles the mind how many there are. I teach IELTS, but I know they must pass CET4 (for BA), CET6 (for graduate school), TEM4 & TEM8 (for English majors), BEC (for Business English majors), and TOEFL. It's crazy the stress some of them feel. And, of course, if they don't pass one they have to take it again. So, I think, some help from a friendly competitor is a good thing. There's room for collaboration. Money is an issue, no doubt, and I don't know their fee structure.

I am a Christian, but I don't go to church. I know of one, though, that meets on Sundays at 8am. This is offered in the spirit of helping you make decisions. I or the students may have misread their intentions, but this is the talk at HUHST.

to get an teaching position in China?  I know there have been some without - but have heard tht often the recruiter gets a fake degree.  RV what are the "rules" on this.

Hi everyone,

I was referring to Sunny's in Chengdu, I haven't been told the name of the school in Loudi yet as my interview has been postponed due to the DoS being unwell.

Thanks for the info though, about Loudi, i have a feeling that it may be a Sunny's... I feel i don't have as much choice of where i work as i don't hold a degree. Its crazy that a degree in basket-making for example could get me a better teaching position.

I have researched a lot about having a degree and not having one. If you have a TEFL then you can generally get a Foreign Experts Certificate. I think even without one, if the school knows the right people, they can get you one, so i've heard. Its a bit of a grey area or so it seems.

...but not a degree. It is a 120 hour one, with 20 hours classroom time.

Yes, you hear so many stories it is hard to know what is true and whats not!

I had the interview with the school in Loudi this morning. The lady i spoke to said the school was called Tongyun Foreign Language School. I have done a quick google search, but there are no results, which is quite worrying?

I'll Check it Out.

It's not enough that you couldn't find it on Google. Afterall, it's a big country and there are many schools that just can't afford to have technology as a resource. That doesn't mean it's a bad school, or that you'd get anything less than you deserve by coming to work for them. I wouldn't worry, not yet anyway, but let us do some research from here on the ground. I'll ask around.

good to know something about the school. :)

The lady that interviewed us seems really nice, she is called Vivienne. She said that she would send some photos of the apartment and school over the weekend. Also she said that the kids ages were 7-18 but that we would mainly teach 7 -12, which is nice. :) Hmm, what else... She also asked if we would bring some English teaching books for kids and said it would be best to bring our laptop if we had one. She said there was internet in the apartment. She said that Loudi was about an hour and a half from Changsha, and that they would collect us from the airport. Though i think this is a pretty standard thing to do.She wants us there soon as the vacany is open now. She advised us to go on a tourist visa, then when we get there she would accompany us to Hong Kong to change it to a Z visa. I know you are always advised against doing this, but it seems a quicker way. I was even thinking that it may be worth just meeting her in HK, as UK citizens don't need any visa for HK, not even a tourist one for up to six months, then just applying for the Z visa as soon as we get to HK and cross the border into China. Has anyone done this before?

To go to Changsha on a tourist visa, then fly to HK to change it to a Z would mean we wouild have to pay for 2 visas, and they aren't that cheap really. It also takes about a week to do the tourist visa here, 4 days to process then a couple of days to get back to us by special delivery post. More if we went in person to the chinese embassy. It may be worth while getting a plane from here to HK, then getting a plane from HK to Changsha, this would get us a tourist one within the hour apparently from HK airport. Then returning to HK with the teacher to get the Z Visa. Of course if its possible to fly to HK, get her to meet us there then get a work visa Z straight from there without having the tourist one first that would be better.

Anyone done anything like this before?

I know little about Visas, RV is the one to talk to about those. It is nice not having to worry about one in HK, but you'd still have to wait a few days for the documents to be processed. And what are the folks at the school going to do? wait around with you? That sounds unlikely. Also, they need special permission to go to SARs (Special Autonomous Regions), so I'm thinking that this is not something they are going to want to do. There's also the matter of a physical, something we all had to do to get the Z Visa. I guess they want to make sure we're not bringing in any cooties (is that how we spell it?) American term used by children to describe germs and other icky things. Boys have lots of them.

About the airport. For a city of 4 million + it's not a very large one, and it is far from Loudi. It costs 250-300 yuan for a taxi, around $40. They should come and pick you up; if they don't it will be very difficult, not impossible, but a real pain to do it on your own by going to the train station, or by going by bus.

The schools are always looking for materials, but there are two very good bookstores not far away that have lots of stuff. So that tells me that this is really a low-budget affair. They haven't the money to purchase them. Or maybe it's a start-up. That means you need to be extra careful. What have they said about a contract? Have they sent you one to look at?

Anywho, talk to you later when I've got more news.

They should send the paperwork, which is an invitation to work there, so that you can get the proper visa. Going to HK is an extra cost for you, just sounds a bit suss to me. You would be away for at least a week in HK, more cost to you. they nay not have creditation for foreigners to work there.

Hi Denise! Welcome to the TACA website from my side; a good option to start your preparation for China, trust me!

Listen, my intention is not to make you negative, but with the little bit of knowledge I have, this thing about the tourist visa and the Hong Kong gimmick just does not sound right ... I usually leave the more weighty comments to the more senior Tacanians, but here I just feel I should warn you to be careful with this one ... Yes, it's exciting to be offered a job on your first interview, but don't make a decision on this too soon. First wait for some more comments on this issue here; I believe Robert our website administrator would most probably give you some advice too as soon as he gets time to look at this post again. I advise you wait on him (and if he takes too long for your comfort, he wouldn't bite your head of if you approach him by private message - there's a tag for that; he might do mine!).

I hope everything would eventually work out for you guys. Don't let some schools or people put you off from coming here. Trust me, this is an incredible country with incredible people (many Tacanians will confirm this as I see similar sentiments appearing in their writings). Ultimately you would love it here and would appreciate coming here!

...for all your replys. :)

I know i need to be cautious. Believe me, i am being. I want to be in China, teaching, so badly, its getting frustrating.

I think its debateable whether i'd get a foreign experts cert anyway, as i don't have the degree thats generally necessary for getting one. :(

Has anyone heard of this particular school at all? Tongyun Foreign Language School, Loudi.

She said it would be better to go on a tourist visa as they want to fill the position quickly and it would take 40 - 50 days to process the documents ( invitation letters etc) for a work visa. And she wants us there sooner than that really.

Things seem a lot harder than i thought they would be to be honest. I don't want to give up though. It is my dream to do this and i really feel that i have a lot to give if i was only given a chance.

Does anyone here know of any openings at any schools?

Hi, Rin, I'm from Loudi. Been asking around and know seems to have heard of it. One school nearby seems to be closing it's doors, however, or renovating for new accommodations. There isn't a Sunny's here either, from what I've asked. The school I mentioned above is called Skyline and actually posted signs around campus a week after I mentioned their situation earlier. They've got an open house set for next week. Maybe I'll pay them a visit.

Hi again :)

I got the contracts through this morning. All looks great. I have been through an agent but have also been in touch with the school directly. They seem very nice and it all seems above board. They want us to go properly on a work visa, so after signing the contract (If we're happy of course) we start to apply for the Z Visa. I think we need to go ahead now and pay for a medical.

So yes, its all very exciting! :)

I found the place, and it was under my nose the whole time.

Located in a dilapidated, dirty, dimly-lit building showing significant signs of wear and lack of maintenance are three schools in the center of town, one of which I teach occasionally at. That's how I found it; I walk by it to get to my parttime job. I am at the university nearby, but was approached by one school, Sailing English Training Center to come and teach now and then, and I have for a few months. I teach two one-hour classes a week, sometimes more, often times less. But that's OK with me; I'm just helping out and earning a few extra yuan.

My school is on the fifth floor and is part of a community school that offers lunch-time, after-school, and weekend classes in dance and art too. They also offer tutoring in other disciplines. On the third floor are two schools, and I haven't seen too many students. It wasn't until I met one of the teachers at Tong Yun Foreign Language School that I was able to invite myself in and take a look around. Nearby is JOER, which is supposed to be like a boarding school where busy parents can leave their children for days and weeks on end. Their facilities look nice, but I have never seen any students. I don't see a lot of students at Tong Yun either frankly. I met two teachers, both newbies, one a graduate of our university, the other graduating. The work with a handful of students one hour a day, five days a week around lunch time. I got one of their brochures.

My friend John helped me translate the thing, so I'm not sure about the accuracy of anything. But it looks like we're pretty close. They've been going since 2003 and offer three different schedules of courses. They just started the Spring semester March 7. Maybe there are other offerings not listed here, but it seems to be limited to English classes, daycare, and English tutoring sessions. It costs parents 720 yuan for 96 classes offered at lunch, after school, and on weekends, and these classes are taught by Chinese. Daycare is available for a variety of primary age groups at lunch and after school. Private and small group tutoring sessions are also available, and there the prices go up significantly, especially as they are promised Native English-speaking Foreign Teachers. 300 yuan for a one to one opportunity, or down to 70 yuan for a class of twelve, is the cost of each session. By the way, they also will provide adults with Business English experience too, I'm told. There are pretty pictures in the glossy brochure with foreign teachers including one of our FTs who had to return home mid-semester last fall for health reasons. That's one of the reasons I'm at Sailing; he taught there too. There were some performances apparently at one point, and there are pictures of students with materials like crayons, coloring paper, balloons, Santa hats, etc.

You have to take all of this with a grain of salt, I think, because I didn't see much around the classrooms. But then we ain't got much either. All visual aids and hands-on materials are brought in by me. I can't even count on chalk. But Tong Yun's chairs seem like a recent purchase, clean blue-plastic contraptions that look a lot more comfortable than the wooden benches my students wobble on. Class sizes appear to be small, and that certainly jives with what I've observed passing the place many times: there are not many students. I have a feeling that my boss has undercut them at this juncture, and I suppose if you take the job we will be competing against each other. Sometimes that's all I really am, I'm convinced, a lure to bring in business. If any English is actually learned while I'm there well great. New Concept and Cambridge Young Learners are used by both schools. It would seem awkward that two schools would be so close together competing against each other, but that's the way it is. And I have little doubt that my boss sees it as anything else but as a business.

This may be more information than you wanted and I doubt there's little more that I can add unless I interview the teachers at length, but to tell you the truth, their English isn't very good and what little I did learn had to be drawn out with care. Best of luck.

Very much for the info!

I didnt see this til now. Funnily enough the contract at Tong Yun seems to have fallen through. My agent hasn't heard from them for ages. The teacher that interviewed me seemed very nice also and the contract looked very good...even proffesional.

Thanks for checking it out for me though. Much appreciated! :)

Good luck with the job hunt and let us know how things work out.

Hi there,

Just thought I'd update you on my situation. Keep active on the forum, ya know! :)

My partner and I have signed a contract with a school in Handan. We should be getting back the signed, stamped contract back from them soon. We are now in the process of applying for our Visa. We are coming to China next month on an F. That is until the school semester starts in September. We will be working at an acquaintances training centre in Shijiazhuang. Then mid August we will fly to HK and exchange our visa for a Z. In time for starting at Handan on 1st September.

I know it is not great to come on an F, but it was us who requested to come to China sooner rather than later. We could have got the Z from here and only came to China at the end of August but the cost of doing the medicals in this country is more expensive than traveling to HK, staying there for a few days and getting the Z visa...and nowhere near as fun!

So...That is the plan! Hope everything turns out well!

Sounds reasonable. On another thread we discussed the medical exams, and it definitely seems that securing one from home is a waste of time and money. They'll just make you have another once you get settled at your jobsite. You've done your research, and I think it will pay off. Keep in touch. We'll have to meet some other way, I guess. Now where is Handan--let me get out my map...

Hi Denise. I somehow missed your April 20th comment about finalizing your contract. So, I was quite surprised today to see you announcing your 31st May flight! I guess this is a good point to say, "congrats"!

But, another thing that I've also missed, is that you start your first 3 months in Shijiazhuang, my previous hometown! I was teaching at a training school there too (called Talking Time Foreign Languages, which is part of the Hutchin schools group). You'll get to love SJZ soon (I think!); much pollution, not attractive, plenty of road and construction work; but still a great city with wonderful people (just over 6 mil)! About Handan (just down the road from SJZ), I can't tell you much but that Toverocker used to teach there and it didn't appear to me that he was unhappy there! 

So, welcome in advance then! Hope everything will work out for you guys!

At last I can say, 'Welcome to China and Shijiazhuang, Denise'!   Well, I hope your 3 months there would be enjoyable to you. I'm excited for you as I know (and got to love) that city! But, in the same breath, I feel somewhat sorry for you too ... because you hit SJZ in the beginning of summer ... and I know those summers! Maybe Handan later in the year will bring some relief (but it's in the same province, so I doubt that ...)! Nonetheless, enjoy your stay and I hope you guys will also fall in love with China and this sometimes strange, sometimes exasperating, but wonderful and lovable people!

Sorry I haven't been on online or on TACA much so I didn't see your message.

I am loving SJZ!! I think the busy city life is amazing! Though, truly, it is TOO hot!! I can't believe it ever gets cold here!

Did you ever go to Scotland bar? Had great fun there the other night!

I'm off to Jiangsu for one month, as we are going to a summer camp. I'm hoping it will be close enough to take some trips to Shanghai in my free time. :)

Thanx for the message, Denise. Glad you find SJZ so appealing! Yes, I agree on the exhaustive summer heat ... specially arriving from Britain where it never really gets hot (as I understand)! Fortunately for you, your time there is limited! But, be warned, Jiangsu might be worse! On the other hand, it may help you appreciating the SJZ summer!

No, I've never heard of the Scotland bar in SJZ! The expats usually hung out at the Harbin restaurant when I was there. Have you ever come across Mike from Scotland during your visit at the SB?! He's a teacher at the language school where I was employed. I'll let you have his number through the PM facility on this site (sorry, Private Message), i.e. if you're interested in contacting him.

Well, have a great time in Jiangsu and when you get back to SJZ! Hope for your sake the Handan weather would treat you better later this year!

Jiangsu is actually better in terms of heat! Maybe it's the rain that cools it? Or the trees? Or being by the Yangtze? I don't know.

Where is the Harbin Restaurant? Haven't come across it? Is it expensive?

On a bit of a budget til we go to Handan. Do you know of any work that we can take on in SJZ, just for a few weeks? Have to do the HK run.. so need to earn some money! Haha.

Are you planning on coming back to SJZ?

Found a little coffee shop called 'Tasty' A guy called Tau owns it. He spent six years in Canada, so his English is great and the bread and coffee's are good. He has a store in Handan too, so that's good to know!!

Have a little scooter now, which makes things easier!

Any recommendations on things to see here?